Talk:James Jesus Angleton

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Home Address

"They lived at 4814 North 33rd Road, in the Rock Spring neighborhood, of Arlington, Virginia.[5]"

Public Records cited on Zillow show the property changing hands in 2005. Since the reference here [5] is his widow's obit (d. 2011), I find no corollary evidence that James Jesus Angleton lived at this address. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.246.45.165 (talk) 00:00, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

Arlington County Property Records show this is the correct address. The house was built in 1949. It was first owned by James & Cecily Angleton, and then by Cecily Angleton (via will) until it was sold to the current owners in 2005. [1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.104.29.206 (talk) 21:43, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Why his middle name in article title?

I thought it was strange when I saw the article listing his middle name (Jesus) as he was never referred by it or signed his name with it, per this academic lecture source (minute 33 to minute 34).[1] Shouldn't his middle name be removed in the title? --115.92.159.28 (talk) 07:04, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I agree. Was Kisevalter Nash? (talk) 20:06, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
We don't generally title articles according to the person's own choice; rather we try and find the most common usage in reliable sources and go with that. I haven't done a search on this particular person, nor will i, though you are welcome to and then present your results, if you so choose. I will say, though, in my personal opinion (i.e., anecdotally, and not a reliable source) no matter what he called himself, he is extremely frequently referred to with the middle name included; happy days, LindsayHello 14:26, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
Hi Lindsay, I just requested a move, so you might be interested in discussing it. This requested move is also not showing up on the main page yet, so if you have any wisdom on how to make it show up, that would also be appreciated. Theodore Christopher (talk) 02:37, 7 November 2025 (UTC)

He was known as "Jesus James Angelton" sometimes people use 3 names like John Wilkes Booth or Lee Harvey Oswald for example. --Massintel (talk) 13:17, 21 July 2022 (UTC)

I believe that's because Angleton is, unfortunately, reviled by most "espionage writers" and former CIA operations officers, and they get their "digs" at him by always writing (or saying) James JESUS Angleton, rather than what he called himself, "James J. Angleton," "James Angleton," or "Jim Angleton." Was Kisevalter Nash? (talk) 20:07, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Statement: You've misspelled his last name. Question: He was known (and referred to) as "James JESUS Angleton" by whom? Answer: His detractors, mostly. Was Kisevalter Nash? (talk) 20:06, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Untitled

Angleton is named as one of the pro-Israel CIA conspirators of the JFK assassination in "Final Judgment: The Missing Link in the JFK Assassination Conspiracy"by Michael Collins Piper. The book is Banned in the US. JFK prevented Israel from developing the nuclear bomb. Ben Gurion considered JFK an enemy of Israel. The ADL, CIA, Meyer Lansky crime family, and MOSSAD were involved in his assassination. The evidence is presented and is stunningly undeniable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:6C1:901:8950:74BD:6D4F:9155:FD7F (talk) 19:59, 17 May 2025 (UTC)

Requested move 7 November 2025

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (non-admin closure) Destinyokhiria 💬 02:45, 29 November 2025 (UTC)

James Jesus Angleton → James AngletonJames Angleton – In scholarly and popular usage, Angleton's middle name is usually omitted. This can be seen in Google's ngram viewer, or a glance at this very article's citations. I understand that "Jesus" is an interesting, fun name, but that doesn't meet Wikipedia standards. I feel confident in stating that the majority of the *scholarly* literature on Angleton omits his middle name, and that Wikipedia, as a serious encyclopedia, should follow this convention. Theodore Christopher (talk) 02:34, 7 November 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. Jeffrey34555 (talk) 06:06, 14 November 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 11:54, 22 November 2025 (UTC)

To play devil's advocate, the ngram might be explained by other James Angletons. Also, it doesn't help that his father and son were James Angleton with different middle names. Presumably, James Jesus would be the primary one people are searching for. Snowman304|talk 03:24, 7 November 2025 (UTC)
Perhaps, but that would not explain why search interest in James Angleton and James Jesus Angleton are basically pegged to each other in the ngram. A Google search for James Angleton only terms up material about the CIA guy, at least for the first few pages of the search. I think that James Hugh also provides a poor excuse---other than the (presumably very small) Cash Register Enthusiast community, I can't imagine there being any research on him unconnected to his son. Theodore Christopher (talk) 04:02, 7 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Support per COMMONNAME, and there's no confusion since no other article on English Wikipedia has the name.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:18, 7 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Oppose: This is one of the most definitive biographies on him and he is called "James Jesus Angleton".
https://books.google.com/books?id=udw1DwAAQBAJ LDW5432 (talk) 12:50, 11 November 2025 (UTC)
A single source (and "definitive"...according to whom? Morley's is one of many journalistic biographies of Angleton) doesn't outweigh the fact that "James Angleton" is a more common format of his name. I never said that "James Jesus" wasn't used at all by some authors, in fact, one of my favorite biographies on Angleton, James Holzman's, uses "James Jesus". I just think Wikipedia should represent the most common format. Theodore Christopher (talk) 19:40, 11 November 2025 (UTC)
Three more "James Jesus Angleton" books:
  1. https://www.amazon.com/James-Jesus-Angleton-Craft-Counterintelligence/dp/1558496505
  2. https://www.amazon.com/Cold-Warrior-Angleton-Master-Hunter/dp/0671662732
  3. https://www.amazon.com/Spytime-Undoing-James-Jesus-Angleton/dp/0151005133
LDW5432 (talk) 22:44, 11 November 2025 (UTC)
With all due respect, I think you're kind of missing the point: I never said that "James Jesus" was an uncommon or strange formatting, only that it was less common and that Wikipedia should go with the majority of scholarly works on Angleton. I also already mentioned the Holzman book. Theodore Christopher (talk) 00:04, 12 November 2025 (UTC)
Yes, we disagree and others can review. LDW5432 (talk) 00:06, 12 November 2025 (UTC)
Exactly. Andrewa (talk) 05:51, 17 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Oppose. His full name is his clear WP:COMMONNAME. In scholarly and popular usage, Angleton's middle name is usually omitted is simply not true. -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:13, 13 November 2025 (UTC)
    The ngram viewer clearly shows that James Angleton sans Jesus is more common. I'd also wonder to what extent use of James Jesus is driven by this Wikipedia article's name, although that's beside the point. Theodore Christopher (talk) 16:24, 13 November 2025 (UTC)
    Disagree that it's irrelevant, it's just very difficult to identify such circular reporting, a similar problem to citeogenesis. Andrewa (talk) 05:05, 14 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Support. James AngletonJames Angleton has been a redirect to this article for almost twenty years nonstop, showing how little case there is for ambiguity, and the shorter name is quite common enough, perhaps even the more common but certainly the more concise. Andrewa (talk) 05:00, 14 November 2025 (UTC)
  • support in the sources from the old old days he is commonly referred to as "James Angleton" (Italian authors), government documents used mostly "James J. Angleton", "James Angleton", and "Angleton, James" government use. "James Angleton" is the most commonly used name by sources, and government as well. Given that there is no other contender for the suggested title, no issue. —usernamekiran (talk) 14:38, 14 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Oppose per comment by Snowman304 and per "Oppose" votes by LDW5432 and Necrothesp. Obviously, there will be no unanimity here, such as in the unsuccessful nomination Carl Jung → Carl Gustav Jung at Talk:Carl Jung/Archive 3#Requested move 14 November 2016. Nonetheless, the "James Jesus Angleton" links submitted by LDW5432 are sufficiently convincing. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 23:48, 22 November 2025 (UTC)
  • Oppose this Cold Warrior is clearly very well known with his middle name. And per LDW5432 -- ~2025-32349-50 (talk) 05:35, 27 November 2025 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.